RE: Bad News on IE6 XML Support

[Michael Rys <mrys@microsoft.com>]

Claude, can I chose the stock certificate to be beaten with :-)

Thanks for your mail.
Michael

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bullard, Claude L (Len) [mailto:clbullar@ingr.com] 
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2001 12:52 PM
> To: Benjamin Franz
> Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
> Subject: RE: Bad News on IE6 XML Support
> 
> 
> You give them too much credit for power or persuasion.  
> 
> As an MSThrall, and veteran of years of different systems 
> back to the IBM1130, if a vendor were to tell us they 
> have a bug that will force us to redo some large quantity 
> of data to be forwards-compliant with a standard, we are 
> likely to do a cost-benefit analysis and if we find out 
> the impact is minimal or not catastrophic, we will
> delay installing any new software until it is cost-effective. 
> We definitely will slow down our incorporation of bleeding 
> edge tech until the churning stops.  Blueberry is an 
> excellent example of that.
> 
> Software vendors of all stripes have had to become 
> "mean and evil" to force customers off old platforms.  :-)
> 
> It is wrong-headed to assume that just because one 
> uses web technology, that all the data is "on the web" 
> or that it will become everyone's problem.  Those that 
> pushed for the Draconian solution to the HTML mess 
> were warned that software developers faced with 
> customers with large volumes of tagged errors would 
> prefer to keep working rather than face a screen 
> that said "Nope!  Not Our Idea of Right!".  I can't 
> recall any time when the developers did not code 
> for user mistakes, migrating standards or mismatched 
> requirements.
> 
> That said:  he is right about not always being 
> able to catch this stuff.  The guys who develop 
> IE are just like us:  opinionated and busy.
> 
> That doesn't mean they shouldn't be beaten with 
> old dot.com stock certificates.  Recycle paper.
> 
> Len 
> http://www.mp3.com/LenBullard
> 
> Ekam sat.h, Vipraah bahudhaa vadanti.
> Daamyata. Datta. Dayadhvam.h
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Benjamin Franz [mailto:snowhare@nihongo.org]
> 
> > However, data outlives code, so once you allow people to 
> store data in 
> > a certain form, you simply cannot disallow them. Warning is 
> an option, 
> > and providing transition periods (that can range several 
> > years/decades). This does not move in internet time, I am afraid...
> 
> Yes, you can. You may not _want_ to do so. It may be 
> politicaly inconvienent do so. But without question - you can.
> 
> Sometimes you have to take the hit on the chin and say to 
> your customers "This is a bug. We know you may have stored 
> data in form X (and here is a tool to help _filter_ the 
> problematic data for you before you deliver it to a client if 
> you absolutely cannot repair your database), but it has to be 
> changed because that behavior was a bug and your XML _will 
> not_ interoperate with other people if it is not fixed now. 
> And the more data you store like this the worse it will get."
> 
> "Bugwards" compatibilty is precisely why HTML ended up in the 
> mess it was in a couple of years ago (and still is in to a 
> large extent). Each new browser had to exactly replicate the 
> _known to be wrong_ behavior of the previous one. Because 
> rather than fix the problem when there were only a few 
> _thousand_ web browsers installed, it was left to fester 
> until their were _tens of millions_ installed.
> 
> That is why you bite the bullet _as early as you can_. 
> Because it only gets worse with time to fester. Trying to 
> save your customers immediate pain by _continuing_ to do the 
> wrong thing makes the situation worse on the long term as 
> their pain becomes everyone _else's_ pain for years to come.
> 
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