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   RE: [xml-dev] Managing Innovation

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Are you guys at work right now? LOL

My boss would kick my a** if I was replying to mailing lists all day
long.  But, you guys are probably C-level -- executive perk number 246?

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bullard, Claude L (Len) [mailto:clbullar@ingr.com] 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 11:32 AM
> To: 'Rich Salz'
> Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
> Subject: RE: [xml-dev] Managing Innovation
> From: Rich Salz [mailto:rsalz@datapower.com]
> > Many Unix experts sitting here dispute that.
> > They tell me Unix is the most easily hacked operating 
> > system they've ever worked with.
> >With all due respect, Len, I do not believe this.  Unless 
> perhaps your
> >experts are conflating a basic Unix system with something running 
> >turn-key applications.  Unless you're able to provide more 
> information 
> >(and I could well believe you can't), we'll just have to leave this 
> >point in open disagreement.
> That is what Spy Vs Spy means:  opinion vs opinion. But 
> you can take my word for it that the sources are people with 
> years of experience with Unix and VAX/VMS before that.  They 
> say it is all about security maintenance and they don't have 
> problems securing our local systems unless a local owner 
> doesn't do the right things.  In that case, his droid is 
> disconnected from the network until he cleans up his act. 
> What we are experiencing is that MS product security is 
> increasing rapidly and steadily.  That this is a new 
> phenomenon is undeniable, but it is real.
> >As for the fading dominance of Unix, etc., it's all 
> relative.  You may
> >sell big systems, but with revenues around a half-billion, 
> your 100-1 
> >ratio is a drop in the bucket.  (BTW, I had to use Google to 
> find those 
> >numbers; using Search on www.ingr.com gets back "index is 
> corrupt"; I 
> >know your front-end claims to be IIS/4.0, so it's probably safe to 
> >assume the back-end is SQLServer.  I hope those SQL worms 
> didn't get to
> it.)
> Sometimes it isn't the revenue, but the kinds of systems.  We sell 
> production systems to very serious people.  BTW:  we are 
> verticalized, 
> so customers vary by division.  We are not a hardware vendor and 
> we don't develop core technology these days (no profit in that). 
> We implement over the Microsoft platform.  Since shifting away from 
> Unix, homegrown platforms, and knowledge intensive tools, we have 
> become profitable and sustained that.  It makes good sense.  We 
> innovate in the application domain, not the operating system layer.
> A standards-based service architecture should not have to be 
> distinguished by the source of the backend systems.  The key 
> to competing is to recognize the migration to the services 
> architecture just below the application layer.
> >Is there anyone on this list who can say with a straight face that 
> >Unix-like operating systems are not an important part of the 
> computing 
> >industry?  Not biggest, not smallest, just important.
> No.  Just that my market doesn't consider it important and we 
> don't try to influence that perception one way or another. It 
> is stated in the RFPs. 
> len
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