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Subject: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] Timestamps
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To: ,
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 14:13:17 -0700
Title: RE: [legalxml-courtfiling] Timestamps
Murray,
Good to hear from you guys! Thanks for the insights.
>> we do populate the Submitted element.
...with the Date/Time (GMT) of the file upload to the filing assembly module.
You have used a document's 'Submitted' element to represent when a filer uploaded a document to your service. That sounds like a reasonable interpretation to me.
I happen to use that node differently - I use it to express the AuthorizedTime - when a filer authorized the filing to be sent. We (FileAndServe) include the same authorized timestamp on all documents, but, in practice, I think only the leadDocument's timestamp is ever consumed.
>> If there were a "Submitted" element at the "envelope" level we would use it.
I take that to mean, you might also have expressed an AuthorizedTime had there been an obvious, well-defined place to include it.. (and/or an explicit requirement).
And, I might guess, that since the AuthoriedTime was not present in your messages, the courts chose to consume your messages' 'CreationTime' because, that happened to be the closest value.. in terms of physical time, and in terms of functional purpose. ( Robert O'Brien can shed some light on that aspect. )
>> "Submission" might be construed as potentially occurring at more than one point in time, particularly in an architecture where reception is not guaranteed and re-submission must be possible.
That's kinda why I avoid using that term in discussions.
It's meaning is too much 'in the eye of the beholder'.
At a glance, it might mean any of these:
- When the message was authorized. ("The filer submitted the data at this time")
- When the message was sent. ("The system submitted the message at this time")
- When the message was received. ("The system received a submission at this time.")
I prefer to use other terms when discussing the functional concepts.
However, when it comes time to give a name to an XML node, I tend to get just a little less fussy.
(Well, only a little less... )
Thanks again for the information.. And the DTD!
- Shane Durham
