Re: [office-accessibility] [Fwd: Re: [office] Drawing page names (Re:[office] OpenDocument TC Meeting Minutes 2006-02-13)]

Rich, Peter,

do I read the minutes from the last SC call correctly that the proposed 
changes are fine for the SC?

Best regards

Michael

Michael Brauer - Sun Germany - ham02 - Hamburg wrote:
> Dear SC members,
> 
> in our recent TC calls we discussed that drawing page names currently 
> have to be unique (see section 9.1.4 in the recent ODF 1.2 draft), while 
> it in practice sometimes may happen that two pages have the same name.
> 
> We discussed several option how to deal with this situation, and the 
> last idea is to
> 
> - keep the uniqueness constrain for drawing page names,
> - but to add <svg:title> and <svg:description> elements to pages.
> 
> This allows authors to assign the same title to two or more pages if 
> they really want to do so for whatever reason, while the names still 
> would be unique. It further allows to assign descriptions to pages, what 
> is also not possible at the moment.
> 
> I accepted an action item to ask you whether this enhancement would be 
> okay for you.
> 
> Malte mentioned that we may add a title and description also to 
> spreadsheet tables. While this goes beyond the original request, it 
> would be good to know your opinion on this as well.
> 
> Best regards
> 
> Michael
> 
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [office] Drawing page names (Re: [office] OpenDocument TC 
> Meeting Minutes 2006-02-13)
> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 14:58:52 +0200
> From: Malte Timmermann <>
> To: Michael Brauer - Sun Germany - ham02 - Hamburg <>
> CC: David Faure <>, 
> References: <> <> 
> <> <>
> 
> Makes sense for me.
> 
> Matches well with what we have for shapes, and the mapping for
> Accessibility API.
> 
> BTW - I propose to have the same for sheets in a spreadsheet:
> - Same features for Accessible Name/Description
> - Sheet names have much more restrictions because of macro access, so
> via the Title people can give them names they otherwise can't.
> 
> Malte.
> 
> Michael Brauer - Sun Germany - ham02 - Hamburg wrote, On 10/26/07 14:11:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have discussed the results of our discussion in the last TC call 
>> with Christian. He suggests that we adapt solution B (the 
>> draw:display-name) a little, and add <svg:title> and <svg:description> 
>> elements instead of a "draw:display-name" attribute. That is, the 
>> draw:name attribute would stay unique, but the <svg:title> element 
>> could be used to add a non-unique name or title to the page.  The two 
>> elements <svg:title> and <svg:description> exist for shapes already. 
>> The solution therefore would be consistent with shapes
>>
>> Christian further suggest that we take first actions to deprecate the 
>> draw:id attribute in favour of the new xml:id attribute, by stating 
>> that they can only appear together, and must have the same name.
>>
>> See below for mor details:
>>
>>> Current Situation
>>>
>>> a <draw:page> element has the following attributes
>>>
>>> "draw:id" defined as a unique id for drawing pages. In OpenOffice.org 
>>> (OOo), this was never used prior to OOo 2.3.
>>> It is currently only used for redundant slide transition information.
>>>
>>> "draw:name" defined as an optional but unique name. OOo either writes 
>>> a programmatic name ("page1", "page2", etc) or
>>> a user defined one, which can contain white space. In the xml format 
>>> it is used for links referring to slides inside a document
>>> and also when defining a custom show. This has the consequence that 
>>> such links break if the user renames the slide.
>>>
>>> a shape element has the following attributes
>>>
>>> "draw:id" defined as a unique id for shapes. This is used to identify 
>>> shapes for animation effects.
>>>
>>> "draw:name" is an optional attribute. It is not documented if this 
>>> has to be unique. In the OOo implementation, shape names
>>> are enforced to be unique but only for shapes on one slide. For 
>>> historical reasons this is also used for links to shapes in OOo. This 
>>> feature
>>> breaks if there are multiple shapes with the same name on different 
>>> slides.
>>>
>>> In addition a shape has the elements <svg:title> and 
>>> <svg:description> to specify text-only description strings for graphical
>>> objects as specified in §5.4 of [SVG]. This was a A11Y requirement.
>>>
>>> Request for non unique page names
>>>
>>> The initial request was that the name of a page should not be 
>>> enforced to be unique. To be consisted and to fulfill
>>> A11Y requirements the <draw:page> element must also have the elements 
>>> <svg:title> and <svg:description>.
>>> In this context the title could be seen as the display name as 
>>> proposed in solution B. For backward compatibility,
>>> if no title is given then the name must be used. On the user 
>>> interface the title must become what the user normally
>>> refers to as the name of the page.
>>>
>>> A new request would be to prepare a conform way to identify pages and 
>>> shape elements inside an odf document.
>>> To enable linking to meta information we must have the xml:id 
>>> attribute for pages (and optionally for shapes).
>>> This would lead to the situation where we have the xml:id, the 
>>> draw:id and the draw:name documented as kind
>>> of identifiers for pages (and shapes).
>>> To have a clean format I propose to add xml:id to both draw:page and 
>>> all shape elements. It will be document that
>>> draw:id attribute is deprecated and that applications must for now 
>>> export the draw:id attribute with the same value
>>> as the xml:id element. The attribute draw:id should be removed in a 
>>> later version as soon as there is no more demand
>>> for backward compatibility. 
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> Michael
>>
>>
> 
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