xml-dev - RE: MS XML parser only works with IE...

[Andrew Layman <andrewl@microsoft.com>]

I think a little more grace and courtesy is called for here.  Microsoft has
been working very hard to ship parsers that track the evolving spec.  As
with any unfinished product, particularly one whose specifications are
clearly marked "work in progress," there are going to be some areas where
the product lags behind the spec or visa versa. 
Regarding the short tagging, did anyone actually run the code?  If so, you
would have discovered that the parser does not respect short tagging unless
you go out of your way to turn it on via an undocumented method that is not
meant for clients to call. It is not a secret feature (we give away the
source code) but it is not part of parsing normal XML.  If we were trying to
trick people into using this facility, we sure went out of our way to fail!
I recommend approaching this with a bit more benevolence and researching
things a little more before assuming a conspiracy.

--Andrew Layman
   AndrewL@microsoft.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Simon St.Laurent [SMTP:SimonStL@classic.msn.com]
> Sent:	Tuesday, November 25, 1997 6:07 AM
> To:	Rick Jelliffe; Xml-Dev (E-mail)
> Subject:	RE: MS XML parser only works with IE...
> 
> >The other point is that floating "&" is required in SGML (even with the 
> >WebSGML adaptations, which have been accepted and are now being
> wordsmithed).
> >Short tagging "</>" is an optional feature that can be enabled.
> 
> I think we would do well to remember that XML is NOT SGML and should not
> be 
> allowed to fall prey to the incredible number of 'options' that have made
> SGML 
> worthless to a large number of developers.  Short tagging is NOT an
> optional 
> feature of XML, and should NOT be a feature of MSXML either.  If it is
> allowed 
> to be an optional feature, than my XYZ parser is either going to have to 
> accept Microsoft's 'extensions' or reject a lot of documents created by
> people 
> who only tested on the Microsoft tools.
> 
> >XML is a choice of particular
> >features by various boffins and experts, and so XML will inevitably be 
> >suboptimal for some uses.  
> 
> Fine.  Let's start off suboptimal and get a standard that works instead of
> a 
> standard that can be embraced and extended by any software company that
> thinks 
> it has a new grand idea.
> 
> >Give us more, Chris and Andrew!  Allow entities to have
> >attributes like SGML does.  Allow tag ommission like SGML and HTML do! 
> 
> Do not give us more, Chris and Andrew, if you really like XML.  If you
> want to 
> kill it quickly, add lots of extra SGML parts. 
> 
> >The problem is not with Microsoft for making their XML parser also handle
> >SGML better, the problem will be with users of the parser in software if
> they
> >use these features over the web rather than inhouse.  I.e. the problem is
> >"us" not "them".
> 
> The problem is an incompatibility between the "us"es and "them"s of the
> world. 
>  Keep XML as clean as possible, at least for now. Forget everything you
> knew 
> about SGML's intricacies and focus on what XML, not SGML, can do for the 
> world, and with any luck, the world might take XML sersiously.
> 
> While working on XML: A Primer, I used the Alpha 1.0 MSXML to test my
> code, 
> aware of many of its difficulties. As I discovered when 1.6 came out, it
> had 
> let me wander outside the spec in a number of key places (mixed
> declarations, 
> for one) that took my code outside of valid XML.  I've fixed it all now,
> but 
> the experience has left me extremely wary of tools that go beyond the 
> standard, intentionally or accidentally.
> 
> Simon St.Laurent
> Dynamic HTML: A Primer / XML: A Primer (January) / Cookies (February)
> 
> 
> 
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