xml-dev - LIST: IMPORTANT: [ was Re: Another XSLT Question]

[Peter Murray-Rust <peter@ursus.demon.co.uk>]

At 02:43 PM 6/27/00 -0600, Bruce Snyder wrote:
>After the lashing I took yesterday by posting my amateur XSLT code, I'm
>hesitant to post again, however, I have another dilemma. 

We try not to "lash" people on this list :-) and my judgment - on the whole
- is that newcomers are treated well - with tolerance and help. 

Bruce's problem arises because this is really a question for the XSLT list
- as already mentioned. He could not be expected to know this from the
XML-DEV web pages.

Information about what to post would normally be on a home page. OASIS
promised us a home page for ***2000-01*** on which all this type of
information could be mounted. Six months later there is still no sign.

I am afraid that I am now going to be critical of OASIS again. Frankly the
organisation of the XML-DEV pages is totally inadequate.

	The home page states:
"
                           XML-DEV Archives (links to
http://xml.org/archives/xml-dev/threads.html)

                           Welcome to XML-DEV@XML.ORG and the XML-DEV
Archives, where serious XML developers
                           share ideas and stay up-to-date on issues in the
XML development community. Please remember,
                           the list is for productive discussion of XML
topics, and should remain a place for and by individuals
                           concerned with XML and its future as an
open-source development resource. 

                           XML-DEV is a self-moderated forum, meaning that
the list's hosts - XML.ORG and OASIS - will do
                           as little as possible to interfere with the
discussion herein, unless it should become necessary to
                           interject in cases where the discussion becomes
unproductive or abusive in nature. 
"

THIS IS THE ONLY GUIDANCE GIVEN FOR POSTERS. HENRY AND I HANDED OVER THE
LIST ON THE CLEAR UNDERSTANDING THAT THE HISTORY, PHILOSOPHY AND CURRENT
MODERATION OF THE LIST WOULD BE HONOURED IN HOME PAGES OR HOME PAGE(S). IN
PRACTICE OASIS HAVE WRITTEN HENRY AND MYSELF OUT OF THE HISTORY AND MYSELF
OUT THE CURRENT MODERATION.

THE ARCHIVE IS NOT SATISFACTORY. THE LINK ABOVE LINKS MERELY TO 2000-02
POSTINGS - THE LATEST IS 2000-02-26. IT HAS ANOTHER LINK 

"Date Index" (http://www.xml.org/archives/xml-dev/maillist.html)

which is broken.

ANY VISITOR APPROACHING THE XML-DEV SITE FROM XML.ORG WOULD THEREFORE
CONCLUDE:
	- THE LIST STARTED AND STOPPED IN FEB 2000
	- THERE WAS NO MODERATION OR MODERATORIAL POLICY
	- THERE WERE NO ARCHIVES
	- THERE WAS NO PREVIOUS LIST
	- HENRY RZEPA AND PETER MURRAY-RUST WERE OF NO IMPORTANCE ANY MORE
	- OASIS DOESN'T CARE ABOUT XML-DEV and MAINTAINING A DECENT SITE FOR IT 

I care about XML-DEV. I find it upsetting that I get repeatedly asked "why
are the archives in a shambles". It is often assumed it is MY fault.  

I have repeatedly mentioned these issues on the list. No action has been
taken. Henry and I have wasted masses of time this year on trying to get
XML-DEV properly supported when we should have been developing CML. The
list is in a worse state than it was when it was handed over.


I am now sorely tempted to take up some of the original offers for
alternative homes where we would have:
	- a collaborative home page
	- a proper sense of history and the worth of the previous list
	- a searchable archive.

>From recent discussions we have seen how important all three are - we need
a proper list management. 

I had assumed from our discussions with OASIS that my concerns would have
been addressed long before now - after the  technical aspects of the list
were solved we were assured that the home page issue, etc. would have been
put in place. It's now three months since - a long time on the web.

I hope that OASIS will now immediately respond with action.

	P.

[And as many of you will appreciate I really hate having to be critical in
public. It upsets me as well as those whom I criticize.]


Peter Murray-Rust. (CML, VHG and XML-DEV)
CMLC and VirtualXML ConCourse: http://www.cmlconsulting.com/ [and XML demos]
CML http://www.xml-cml.org/
Virtual HyperGlossary http://www.vhg.org.uk/ [new website; has XML demos]

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