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Yep. Problems. I note that they were
resolved as they were notified, and that
list members assisted. Some such as the
unsubscribe bug are recurring.
I am mystified that Liam cannot subscribe
or post. That is strange but not personal.
It simply makes no sense that an organization
for creating XML standards would decline to
subscribe the XML Activity Lead at the W3C.
So, it's yet another symptom of a bad bug
in the listserver, is my guess.
Lomas posted an email describing what is
being done to fix the problems. I suggest
that Liam send him mail to notify him that
he (Liam) needs to be subscribed and what efforts
he has made to do this. I think
we should give Lomas and his staff time to
work the problem. Others think differently.
When the alternatives are presented, it
may mean a divided membership, or one list
withers. One can't actually move a list.
One can start a new one and recruit. Such
was the fate of comp-text-sgml when Henry
and Peter proposed XML-Dev.
If OASIS undervalues XML-Dev, that is not
a technical problem, I agree. But I don't
know what is needed to ensure that any other
organization offering to host XML-Dev will
value it equally or better or that promises
made during recruitment will be honored
six months later. So consider past behaviors
of both technical quality and oversight.
We've had a rather unencumbered existence
However, Karl said that OASIS must provide value to its
membership and one thing we should consider
is if XML-Dev provides value. Given that
this is a good place to get XML questions
answered (if not XSLT or all the other
lists to which people are often redirected),
is that our only value? I consider
XML-Dev the one place that the developers of
specifications and standards must present
their work and convince an experienced and
often skeptical audience of the value of
their work. OASIS is in the standards
business. Perhaps one value of XML-Dev
to the OASIS membership is that if the
developers cannot convince the XML-Dev
members of the value of an OASIS product,
it is quite likely that the value of that
product is limited, and they need to know
that right up front.
If one can't sell it to the groundlings,
it isn't likely to sell in the court.
From: Simon St.Laurent [mailto:email@example.com]
firstname.lastname@example.org (Bullard, Claude L (Len)) writes:
>Why don't we find out what it is that is going
>wrong with the listserver first? Give the technical
>guy assigned to the task a bit of time to figure
>out the problem.
It's a recurring problem, or set of problems.
To quote Karl Best:
"I recall having sent almost identical messages to this list a couple of
times a year over the past three years, obviously to no effect."
Taking a quick look through xmlhack.com archives, there are:
Murray-Rust lashes out at OASIS over XML-DEV
OASIS declares victory on XML-DEV mailing list problems
Developing community facilities for XML-DEV
OASIS President apologizes, says deadline won't be met
XML-DEV's founder losing faith in OASIS
Is XML-DEV coming back?
XML-DEV silent for days
The move itself was reported on in:
Based on Karl's message, it seems pretty clear that OASIS has other
things they could do with the resources they spend on xml-dev. Moving
the list might well be good both for OASIS and for the list.
Ring around the content, a pocket full of brackets
Errors, errors, all fall down!
http://simonstl.com -- http://monasticxml.org
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