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   RE: [xml-dev] Challenge

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There are XForms clients that work entirely client-side, and in fact one of
them (DENG http://claus.packts.net/deng/ ) works in all browsers that
support Flash and is almost zero install, and another, (FormsPlayer
http://www.formsplayer.com) is an IE plug-in.

The implementation Mark mentioned does its processing server side, but
there's no requirement to do that; it's just easier to implement if you
don't have source for the browser.

There is active discussion going on about implementing XForms for
Mozilla/FireBird, but a substantial number of people who choose to comment
on the issue are opposed to XML, or opposed to implementing W3C standards
because they aren't open enough, or want to skip all this XML stuff and do
it all in JavaScript, etc.  So it's not settled down, but I assume once it
does, people will begin to implement it for Mozilla.


-----Original Message-----
From: Didier PH Martin [mailto:martind@netfolder.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 05, 2003 1:54 PM
To: 'Mark Seaborne'; xml-dev@lists.xml.org
Subject: RE: [xml-dev] Challenge

Hi Mark,

Firstly, thanks for a first concrete example of how you would do it (at
least we got finally some sample code).

If I understand well, the Xform is processed on the server side. The XML
document is filled on the server not in the browser. However it's quite
close, the process is
a) Create an XForm document to bind widgets to xml elements. This should
provide sufficient information to an XForm processor to relate a visual
object to an XML element. So far so good.

What is missing now is a way, at least on a certain browsers (probably not
all) to modify the XML document on the client side and send it back to the

I am also trying myself to respond to the challenge. I think your solution
is a step toward a solution. I am thinking how I can make the browser to set
the XML document before sending it back to the server. This way, we would
have a real apps on the client side. 

Here is my Hypothesis:
a) I create an XSLT stylesheet taking your XForm document and transforming
it into HTML
b) The transformation can occurs on the client side in modern browsers like
Mozilla or IE. But they are not handling the XML document the same way. Some
investigation to be done there.
c) I know that IE simultaneously keep the XML document, the XSLT document
and the HTML document in memory. Any one of these documents can be accessed
at run time through their respective DOM.
d) The trick now is to relate some of the HTML elements to some of the XML
element. Not easy, but I'll persevere.

Except performing transformation on the server side or using a server to do
the data content insertion, any other ideas? Come on, I though the actual
XML based tools where able to do what XAML proposes to do? 

Anyway, thanks a lot for all of us who answered to the challenge.

Didier PH Martin

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