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   Re: WebStandards.org (Off Topic)

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  • From: Chris Hubick <maillist@chris.hubick.com>
  • To: xml-dev@ic.ac.uk
  • Date: Sat, 8 Aug 1998 10:16:05 +0000 (GMT)

On Sat, 8 Aug 1998, Tim Bray wrote:

> At 11:08 PM 8/7/98 -0400, Frank Boumphrey wrote:
> >why did'nt you tell us about this.
> >We should all support it.
> >http://www.webstandards.org
> Gimme a break, just found out about it at noon Friday.  Yes, I think
> it's a worthwhile effort.  It's not my idea, the other guys on
> the list dreamed it up and launched it. -T.

	I think it is a great effort as well.  My only problem with it is
that none of the web pages on the site validate.  I find it hard to take
an organization pushing web standards seriously if they can't even follow
the standards themselves.  I wrote Jefferey Zeldman, the site designer,
and told him basically that...

On Sat, 8 Aug 1998, Jeffrey Zeldman wrote:
> chris:
>       thanks for writing.
>       i do use harmless workarounds to avoid display errors.
>       i do this because the browsers don't support the standards.
>       for instance, i need to include a non-breaking space after i close
> a DIV tag, because in IE 4.01/Mac, "DIV" is not treated as a block level
> element, even though the standards say it should be.
>       adding that non-breaking space causes the browser to follow the
> </DIV> with a line break, as it is supposed to do.
>       as other versions of explorer do. as netscape 2, 3, and 4 do.
>       in other words, when necessary to avoid errors caused by browser
> bugs, i  resort to workarounds which degrade well and cause no harm.
>       however, those workarounds might snag an html validator.
>       i can live with that more easily than i can live with a web page
> that is impossible to read.
>       i did discuss this with the other WaSP members, and explained my
> rationale.
>       but i thank you for mentioning it.
>       in a way, it helps make the case for us.
>       when the browser manufacturers deliver browsers that follow the
> standards, we will be free to make completely validatable html.
>       until that day, we have to make tough choices. this is mine.
> jeffrey

	I unfortunately disagree with his opinion.  I think it is always
possible to create web pages that validate, it just involves either
sacrificing the use of some features, or recognizing that some browsers
may render the site improperly.  Usually most of the "harmless" hacks
authors use to get things to display properly can be implemented in 
a way that also validates, if you take the extra time to try.


Chris Hubick

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