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Naren,
I've been puzzled sitting through presentations at XML conferences on
Native XML Databases. Frequently, these presentations include a statement
on some slide along way like:
-> RDBMS's are great for corporate, relational data
-> But, it's great to have your XML information in a separate store
To me, a separate store means (perhaps) a second DBA and (almost surely)
separate backup and recovery techniques (assuming the other databases have
the notion of recovery, which I assume they do, don't they?).
You can definitely go with a separate store, but Oracle believes most customers
will want all of their data managed, queried, backed-up, recovered, etc. in one
place with a single engine that can handle all types of data. In our case, with the
release of Oracle9i R2, that "all types of data" includes rich support for Schema-driven
XML, XSLT, XPath, and SQLX built right into the same engine that we've improved
over the last 25 years. Plus, with our object *view* capability, you can make
XMLType data look like relational data through a view, and any existing relational
data look like (optionally-Schema-constrained) XMLType data so you can store the
data in the format that's best for you (and perhaps, your existing applications),
serve-up the data in whatever format is best for you (relational or XML) and query
that data in a consistent language (SQL + SQLX XML Extensions + XPath Support)
regardless of the type of data you're working with.
We're tracking XQuery too, and have a prototype of our XQuery support up on our OTN site.
__________________________________________________________________
Steve Muench - Developer, Product Mgr, Java/XML Evangelist, Author
Simplify J2EE and EJB Development with BC4J
http://otn.oracle.com/products/jdev/htdocs/j2ee_bc4j.html
Building Oracle XML Apps, http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/orxmlapp
----- Original Message -----
From: "Naren Chawla" <naren_chawla@attbi.com>
To: "Steve Muench" <Steve.Muench@oracle.com>; "Ranjeet Sonone" <ranjeet@ipedo.com>; "Dare Obasanjo" <dareo@microsoft.com>; "Tim
Bray" <tbray@textuality.com>; "Roth, Scott (ITD)" <Scott.Roth@state.ma.us>
Cc: <xml-dev@lists.xml.org>
Sent: Friday, August 30, 2002 10:17 AM
Subject: RE: [xml-dev] XML indexing/search engine
Ahem.. if Oracle 9i R2 is going to do all this for me, why would I invest $$ to introduce new data store and associated problems
(considering TCO) into my enterprise ?
--naren lives
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Muench [mailto:Steve.Muench@oracle.com]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 3:48 PM
To: Ranjeet Sonone; Dare Obasanjo; Tim Bray; Roth, Scott (ITD)
Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
Subject: Re: [xml-dev] XML indexing/search engine
| any takers?
Sure. My answers here are regard Oracle9i Release 2's XML Database features...
| Just speaking of XML to relational mapping, it does look
| straightforward, not until you deal with issues such
| as mapping the XML data model, validating the content against a given
| DTD/XMLSchema
| When you suggest, "just map the XML data model to RDBMS tables",
| please shed some more light on how to do it, and without trying to
| justify your faith towards RDBMS, honestly reveal the efforts involved.
First, you register your XML Schema like this:
EXEC Dbms_XmlSchema.RegisterSchema(
"security.xsd", getDocument("security.xsd"));
Then you create a table (or table with a column) of XMLType
bound to that schema like this:
create table securityDocs of xmltype
xmlschema “security.xsd" element "security";
or with your XML Document in a column, like this:
create table securityDocs ( id number, securityDoc xmltype)
xmltype column securityDoc xmlschema “security.xsd" element "security"
Then you load your document by using an INSERT statement,
an HTTP POST, a WebDAV file put operation, an FTP put,
or using our SQL*Loader bulk loader utility.
We do basic validation against the schema automatically,
and if you want to force immediate full validation (most users
like to do the full validation in a batch later, but it's your choice)
you can create a BEFORE INSERT trigger on your table
that calls the schemaValidate() method on the xmltype being
inserted to achieve that.
| and most importantly having a whole set of document based
| management and retrieval interface.
Oracle9i Release 2 database have WebDAV, FTP, and
HTTP protocol support, as well as ACL based security and
virtual content foldering features built-in. This makes
content management with XML docs much easier.
| This true about most of the relational stores that support
| XML, and not just SQL Server.
Not true about Oracle9i Release 2. :-)
| For a healthy excercise, please use the data given below,
| shred it in RDBMS of your choice and then try to provide
| a document-centric access to the data or at least try to retrieve
| the entire document content, preserving the document identity (name).
| <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
| <!DOCTYPE security SYSTEM "security.dtd">
| <security>
For truth in advertising, we only support XML Schema 1.0 and not DTD
for the O/R mapping (due to lack of useful datatype info in the DTD).
We do support full DOM fidelity in our storage, so comments, processing
instructions, and node ordering does not get lost if you want to preserve it.
Full XPath searching (a reasonable subset of which support query rewriting
by our database engine to use relational indices under the covers) is also
supported as is a superset of the emerging SQLX standard for XML-in-SQL
syntax being developed in ANSI/ISO.
__________________________________________________________________
Steve Muench - Developer, Product Mgr, Java/XML Evangelist, Author
Simplify J2EE and EJB Development with BC4J
http://otn.oracle.com/products/jdev/htdocs/j2ee_bc4j.html
Building Oracle XML Apps, www.oreilly.com/catalog/orxmlapp
| -ranjeet
|
|
| -----Original Message-----
| From: Dare Obasanjo [mailto:dareo@microsoft.com]
| Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 11:16 AM
| To: Tim Bray; Roth, Scott (ITD)
| Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
| Subject: RE: [xml-dev] XML indexing/search engine
|
|
| If an XML-enabled RDBMS which supports importation and exportation of
| XML is an option then the combination of SQL Server and SQLXML does the
| job very well. More info at
|
| http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnexxml
| /html/xml07162001.asp
|
| -----Original Message-----
| From: Tim Bray [mailto:tbray@textuality.com]
| Sent: Fri 8/23/2002 11:04 AM
| To: Roth, Scott (ITD)
| Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
| Subject: Re: [xml-dev] XML indexing/search engine
|
|
|
| Roth, Scott (ITD) wrote:
| > Hi -
| >
| > I am starting to design an application that will be a
| calendaring/event engine for the State of Massachusetts and all of its
| agencies (Department of Public Health, Registry of Motor Vehicles,
| etc...). We plan on putting an appropriate calendar event schema in
| place, and then starting to generate 1 XML file per event (public
| hearing, course, forum, workshop, whatever...). This will build up
| quite a large amount of small XML files quickly. My question is this -
| what is the best way to store these files for easy indexing and
| searching? The actual files will be stored in our content management
| system, so I am not worried about updating the information - merely
| being able to efficiently query the collection. Apache's Xindice seems
| to be the frontrunner so far. I am envisioning storing the collection
| in Xindice and returning a nodeset to my XSL that contains file names
| that match whatever the query was. The XSL is then free to iterate
| through each matching file using the d
| ocument function and grab whatever information for display that
| the current page requires. Is there other software that I should be
| considering? Other approaches?
|
| The idea of making this information available in XML is a good
| one and I
| salute Massachusets for this progressive and sensible move.
| Publishing
| the schema is smart too. Of course, just because you're going
| to make
| it available in XML doesn't mean you have to store/maintain the
| data in
| XML. Could you put an output filter on your content-management
| system
| and hook it up to the web with one of the many gateway products?
|
| Of course, many CM systems don't take kindly to a high volume of
| queries
| & exports (as in choke, fall over, die, lock up)... maybe you
| could
| batch-dump this stuff into a simple rdbms (oracle, mysql,
| whatever), and
| gateway to that while XMLifying the export; these things tend to
| search
| well and hold up under query loads. Does the retrieval really
| need to
| be full-text or could fielded query search out of an RDBMS
| handle it?
|
| Summary: XML for export and interchange is totally the way to
| go. How
| you get there? Acronyms that begin with X aren't that relevant.
|
| Now all the XDBMS vendors are going to complain about my lack of
| fidelity to the religion of the XML data model, oh well.
|
| > I am anxious to get this right, as this will be the model for
| other statewide templatizing applications - for example, press releases.
|
| It shouldn't be *that* hard. Once you do it, let us know how it
| went,
| or submit a paper to one of the conferences or something. -Tim
|
|
|
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