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RE: [xml-dev] What is declarative XML? (And what's not)



“How do you exclude assumed semantics?”


What is a satisfactory semantic for ‘semantic’?  We imagine we understand it then default to syntax.   We “assume”.   Semantics default to systems.   Rick’s examples demonstrates where those tradeoffs emerge in the structures we prefer given alternatives.   Why div class=?


I’m not assuming semantics but qualifying them by asking why does the order <div class=warning have a higher frequency than <warning?    My model:  entanglement.   Multiple systems/sources are being controlled or controlling the markup.  The intensity of the semantic in the system is set by the use of the system, it’s behaviors over time and how those behaviors result in semantically coherent communications among system users.   Semantic strength as intensity is fun because it is a simple scalar.   Otherwise, it is amplitude.


Given <div class= (warning or note) is the probability of one of the members affected by the div?  No.  Only the probability of the set itself given the class and the class given the div.


To which systems are each of the members significant?   Is the syntax or containment significant to the systems?  Why that preferred structure?


Systems entanglement is a reasonable model.


Kurt:  not quantum XML except insofar as features of XML map to quantum concepts.  It is a model of systems phasing and the affect of it on communications.   Consider the example from Raph Koster’s list about character and environment persistence.   How much state maintenance is worth it?   How much dynamic complexity can an observer observe before it becomes deconstructive interference?  In games, this is not just a model of rendering but of game play itself and the choices game designers have to make to ensure a game is fun and coherent given multiple players.   Coherence is a quality of game play, therefore, of transformations over time.   As to the probability strength, it seems to me that it is not in the markup.  It is in the process.  The markup is the interference pattern.  




-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Hunt [mailto:greg@firmansyah.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 1:43 AM
To: XML Developers List
Subject: Re: [xml-dev] What is declarative XML? (And what's not)


Fuzziness is not only a feature of quantum mechanics, its a core feature of human communication... and that fuzziness is what causes Roger's desire for self-contained/processing-semantics-free and processing contexst-free documents to break down.  How do you exclude assumed semantics?
I'm also not convinced that Len is trying to be intelligible. 

On Tue, Jun 2, 2009 at 4:01 PM, Kurt Cagle <kurt.cagle@gmail.com> wrote:

Oh, god, we're entering into the world of quantum XML!!

Overall, however, I'm not sure this is the most accurate conceptual metaphor. I'm much more inclined to see various potentially overlapping models as being frames of reference in describing reality, in essence more of a relativistic approach, with transformations acting as tensors mapping completely or incompletely between these frames of reference.

The problem with contemporary computational semantics (RDF et al) is that assertions are binary - there is absolutely nothing in RDF that can be used to view assertions in a stochastic or fuzzy manner, which is one of the fundamental characteristics of quantum systems. You can make a reasonably strong case for being able to make logical inferences with RDF - this was what it grew out of, of course. However, there's no formal mechanism in RDF as it stands right now to be able to say "the probability or strength of assertion X is 0.75". That's not to say that this couldn't be introduced, mind you, and I'm not so sure that it's necessarily a bad idea, though the processing becomes considerably more complex at that point once you do make that step.

Kurt Cagle
Managing Editor

On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 8:12 PM, Len Bullard <cbullard@hiwaay.net> wrote:

The concept analogizes semantic coherence to interferometric visibility and
semantic intensity to intent of communicative speech act as expressed in the

Treat the name and label particles like wave functions where each element
has intensity.

What would the coherence/decoherence properties of RDF be contrasted to
HTML?  I think the coherence length of RDF statements would be better
because they are unentangled until related.



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