Re: [xml-dev] JavaScript (was Re: [xml-dev] Whither XML ?)

[Rob Koberg <rob@koberg.com>]

David,

Check out:

http://ajaxian.com/archives/want-to-pack-js-and-css-really-well-convert-it-to-a-png-and-unpack-it-via-canvas

"or you could use a lossless packing system that is already in use and
supported in browsers. In this case the packed format is PNG and the
way to unpack it is by using the canvas API's getImageData() method:"

best,
-Rob

On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 4:34 AM, David <dlee@calldei.com> wrote:
> My concern about JavaScript in the browser as the "VM of the Browser" is its
> lack of binary data support.   I am not an expert in JS myself, but my
> colleagues who are doing very heave JS development on mobile devices tell me
> this is one of the biggest problems.    There is no native data type to hold
> binary data.   Yes you can have an 'array of number'   but this is very VM
> inefficient, its really an array of *objects* not a contigous byte array.
> Furthermore the API's that are supported (atleast in the mobile space) do
> not allow binary network transfer into JS, only text.   This is a huge
> problem for transferring large data to mobile devices to/from servers.  You
> have to text encode everything, and even then, you cant decode it to binary
> in the JS layer  because there is no binary type.   So everything has to be
> text.  And with JS's (like java's) UTF16 internal storage for strings were
> talking serious memory and CPU cycle wastes.
>
> Somehow the underlying system can handle it (think images for web pages),
> but it is not exposed to the JavaScript API layer so developers cannot do
> anything with binary data that is not 'built in'.
>
> I'd love to hear this is totally wrong so I can go back to my friends and
> tell them how to 'do it right', but I have confidence they've sweated over
> this for over a year and have no solution besides dropping down to the OS
> layer for all binary data and networking.   But the "OS Layer" is not
> portable, and on some devices not accessable.
>
> With the advent of HTML5 with local storage, I think people will want to do
> more and more on the browser what mobile already has to do, which is
> pre-download large chunks of data so that they can run efficiently in low or
> no connectivity situations (disconnected, or intermittently disconnected).
> Until the infrastructure catches up *a lot* the entire fantisy that every
> device is 'always connected' to a high bandwidth internet is a fools
> fantasy.    Even in metro areas where it is supposed to be true, its not, in
> fact its often worse due to congestion.   Lack of good binary support for
> transfer, internal use, and internal storage is a huge killer for JS, IMHO.
>
>
>
>
> David A. Lee
> dlee@calldei.com
> http://www.xmlsh.org
>
>
> On 11/11/2010 7:07 AM, Simon St.Laurent wrote:
>>
>> On 11/11/10 6:09 AM, Pete Cordell wrote:
>>>
>>> Just wondering...
>>>
>>> If other languages such as Java, C# etc. can be compiled to Javascript,
>>> do
>>> people see problems with Javascript being the bytecode of the Internet?
>>
>> I don't, unless everyone hates Lisp.  I don't even think compilation to
>> JavaScript is very necessary, though GWT demonstrates it can be usefully
>> done.
>>
>> JavaScript has grown tremendously over the last decade, not just in
>> sprawling reach but also in best practices.  It's making a lot of people
>> retire assumptions about object-oriented development that they picked up
>> from Java or C++, and to be honest it's beating out assumptions people
>> picked up from XML with JSON.
>>
>> I'm pretty much shifting to JavaScript completely these days, even looking
>> to Node.js for server-side JavaScript.  I'll be using it for small things,
>> but it turns out that JavaScript is also a good fit for scaling up because
>> you can write non-blocking code in it relatively easily.  I still do like
>> Ruby and Rails, but while metaprogramming is cool, it's not necessary.
>>
>> Not that you all should drop what you're doing and grab a copy of
>> JavaScript Patterns, but I'm hoping that the JavaScript-bashing will
>> subside.  My favorite recent quote:
>>
>> "It used to be that if you programmed in JavaScript, no one took you
>> seriously.  Now, if you don't, they won't take you seriously."
>>
>> Good luck in a changing world,
>
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