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Re: [xml-dev] Where is XML going

This has been a fascinating discussion, but here's my two cents worth.

I think that one of the more significant ramifications of the AJAX movement is that it has caused a fairly radical change in the relationship between the server and the client. Pre-ajax, the server's primary domain was the serving up of the presentation layer to the client. Post-ajax, the server's role has been increasingly to provide data for components on the client to consume. Certainly presentation content is still the overwhelming majority of content, but if present trends continue, it is likely that within the next decade the bulk of the traffic on the web will not in fact be presentation layer but rather data as a service, with a much thinner substrate of user interfaces. Moreover, I think that as RESTful architectures (and dynamic RESTful services themselves) become more widespread, one consequence of this is that it will be the consumer of the data (or rather that consumer's client software) that will ultimately determine the best form to present that data in.





Kurt Cagle
XML Architect
Lockheed / US National Archives ERA Project



On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 8:03 PM, David Lee <dlee@calldei.com> wrote:
I respectfully disagree.
The server may well be "closed" and the browser may be "open" .. or visa-versa ...
I donít think "open" vs. "closed" is the issue.

In my opinion the server is 'closer to the data' then the browser. †It has more chance of knowing about the meaning of the data then the browser.
And also has access to possibly higher compute power as well as 'back end' data to aid in translation to presentation format.

If We take the server as the knowledge repository and the browser as †the presentation layer ( I know this isn't the only model but I argue itís a good one), †then the Server->Browser transition it would be the servers' responsibility to translate data representation into presentation data.
I argue that is the correct place to do the transformation.

Now if were talking about B2B (server<->server) then passing the raw XML between parties may make sense, or perhaps a transformed XML which is transformed to the domain intended to the other party.

I am still not convinced yet why the browser is the 'right place' to do Data to Presentation transformations.
Maybe it is, and I would love an argument for it.
I think this is a fundamental architectural question. †What is the responsibility of the browser on the web and what is the responsibility of the serer ?
I would suggest that the concept of "server serving static data documents" is no longer valid ...
The dividing line is indeed gray ...but is there a universal consensus of separation of concerns ?



----------------------------------------
David A. Lee
dlee@calldei.com
http://www.xmlsh.org


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Kay [mailto:mike@saxonica.com]
Sent: Saturday, December 04, 2010 6:42 PM
To: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
Subject: Re: [xml-dev] Where is XML going


On 04/12/2010 21:38, David Lee wrote:
> I'll stil bite and raise you a devils-avococate.
> Explain to me why its "better" that XML be translated in the browser to presentation then on the server.
Because that's a more efficient use of resources, and enables a more
interactive and responsive presentation.
> Compare/contrast that to the cost of requiring ALL browsers in the entire world to adopt your technology vs only requiring the server hosting the particular content to adopt it.
>
The ONLY reason for doing it on the server is that the server is an open
platform while the browser is a closed platform. So fix that problem.

Michael Kay
Saxonica

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