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RE: [xml-dev] Principles for an Ethical and Sustainable Internet - XML

I agree with the arrogant part, Mike.  I'm not very concerned about it.
See quote from Keynes.   Whereas the cooler heads in the entertainment
industry tried to be reasonable, the harsh and ill-informed responses
from the web industry have led most to believe the web industry will
have to be bitch-slapped into near unconsciousness before they will own
up to their responsibilities. By contrast to other debates I've seen in
the last five years, this is quite relaxed.  The quote I sent to Liam
was a calm response from one of the world's top music producers whose
name you would recognize.  Their patience with this is much thinner than
the skins here.  If XML can help solve problems, that is good. If not,
then XML is irrelevant.


As someone who does score original compositions, the import and export
into and out of Finale and/or Sibelius are very important.  Submissions
are made with PDF for the first review so a publisher can determine if
they want to pursue it further.  After the first review, there is a
process of editing the score with the publisher in accordance with their
opinions about what will sell.  How the files are exchanged depends on
what the publisher prefers and the composer has.  XML is a last resort
but it works and can be applied to non-print composition work.  I don't
know if anyone is experimenting with XSLT driving a la Cage, but it
might be fun.  I have used the XML from time to time when exchanging
scores with others.

Most of the print market is religious and academic where they need to
sell at least 10k copies at average $1 USD per copy because they will
spend around 10k for printing a first run.  They also have to absorb the
illegal copying at the Xerox machines but they will absorb that in small
amounts just as the recording industry absorbs the party mix discs,
wedding videos, and so on.  Without an import/export format, we are
stuck the same way WYSIWYG publishers are.  At print time, they do use
the native formats of course and render to PDF for online distribution
in some cases.  Most won't do that for full scores openly because, of
course, theft on the Internet is pervasive.  What is common is a first
or maybe two pages of the score and an mp3 rendering.  The second one is
expensive to produce so they often lock that up in a site player to
prevent copying.  Others allow one to download it.

Finale is preferred.  I use Sibelius.  It is better suited to orchestral
scoring.  It has a terrible interface, is deuce complex, but once one
gets through that and the terrible documentation, it has an excellent
sample library for rendering so I use it both for giving samples to the
ensembles and for some recording where I need a full orchestral part and
standard midi isn't as rich.  Often I mix the two for richer timbre.


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Kay [mailto:mike@saxonica.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 8:16 AM
To: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
Subject: Re: [xml-dev] Principles for an Ethical and Sustainable
Internet - XML

On 30/08/2012 13:49, Len Bullard wrote:
> For XML experts, you are a poorly informed bunch.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MusicXML
While there are some brave souls pushing MusicXML as a distribution 
format, it hasn't really made a significant impact in that role yet. See

for example http://www.makemusic.com/musicxml/music, which by 
advertising what's available makes it clear that it's not very much. If 
you want a particular score, you are much more likely to find it in PDF 
or in a proprietary format such as Finale or Sibelius.

Len, Amy is right to point out that you are being a little bit arrogant 
this week.

Michael Kay
> From: Amelia A Lewis [mailto:amyzing@talsever.com]
> To the best of my knowledge and belief, music is not distributed in a
> form related to an xml technology. Digital restriction management may
> use xml; if so, let's hear something about that technology, and its
> successes and shortcomings. Lawyers may be using xml technology in the
> prosecution of cases; that, too, might be of interest to the
> on the list.
> Moral indignation on behalf of those unrighteously deprived of their
> holy profits? Not so much, in my opinion.
> Amy!


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