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   RE: RE: RE: [xml-dev] WD for Namespaces 1.1

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Thanks for reading the paper.  It still gives 
me a headache. Doug Lenat hated it outright. ;-) 
I put it away and forgot about it.  

The capability of the system to use the namespaces 
is there already, so emergence is not stifled.  
Why does it need to be in the core?

One problem is that controls are emergent based 
on engagement of two systems or communicating 

If we push that one down a layer, do we get a benefit?  We 
may have to decide if a namespace is as P. Stickler 
said, just punctuation.  Masinter said, a URI 
is never just punctuation unless context is invoked. 

So either context matters and we end up with a lot 
of complex constraints, or a URI was the wrong beastie 
for namespace values and the Myth of Names and Addresses 
is wrong.

Hey, just for noodling:  if a primitive taxon 
is an XML production at namespace(0), that is, 
the namespace cannot have subordinate namespaces, 
is an aggregate expressed as namespace(complex number)?  What 
implications are there for the cenospecies, 
ecospecies, and ecotypes?  What do varying values 
for the complexity number have for the characteristics  
of self-organization, self-modification, self-maintenance, 
and self-transcendence?

Assert:  a document without namespaces is always at namespace(0) 
regardless of internal complexity.  Component assemblies are 
never namespace(0).

Dang.  We can do a year or two on this one. 


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Champion [mailto:mc@xegesis.org]
Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 2:22 PM
To: xml-dev@lists.xml.org
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [xml-dev] WD for Namespaces 1.1

4/4/2002 2:15:09 PM, "Bullard, Claude L (Len)" <clbullar@ingr.com> wrote:

>What is the value of adding namespaces to the core 
>unless every system layer above it depends on them?

"Emergent intelligence is a principle of complexity theory applied to systems
evolution. [3]. It refers to the ability of a system as it becomes complex to exhibit
behaviors not possible until a set of subsystems are merged and interact."
http://www.eco-online.com/pdf/infoeco.pdf  [Look familiar Len? :~) ]

Without subsystems to interact, you don't get emergence.  What if,
10 years ago, one could get HTML separately from URLs and HTTP.
"What's the value of adding URLs and HTTP ...I don't use anything
in HTML  that depends on it, why do I need it?"  The reason is that the 
"emergent property" of HTML+HTTP+URL (aka "the Web") is so much more
valuable than any individual piece.  So, there's a dilemma: modularization
and "best of breed" components are a good thing, but emergent intelligence
is an even better thing. 

The value of namespaces as a truly universal, must have, integral 
part of XML is still TBD, as far as I'm concerned, but the argument would
be that XML without namespaces is like HTML without HTTP.  Adding 
namespaces to the core ensures that some new "emergent intelligence" that
depends on both can thrive without anyone having to install anything.  

Again, I personally am somewhat skeptical of the situation in this particular
case, but I definitely sympathize with the argument, with or without a
concrete value proposition for today.  

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